Jim Moseley: Saucer Smear and Other Foibles

Anyone who has been in the UFO biz for even a little while knows about the legendary Saucer Smear zine. What started out as a small and fairly serious newsletter over 50 years ago has evolved into the publication of record for all of the arguments, infighting and feuds amongst researchers and others in the field. Balanced with Moseley’s sharp humor and eye for a good story, Smear remains the only UFO publication that is eagerly awaited and read from start to finish as soon as “nonsubscribers” get their copies in the mail, usually about once a month.

Moseley’s buddy Tim Brigham asked if I would record a conversation with Jim before he goes in for surgery next week. None of us had any set agenda or questions, but the conversation did feature a few comments from Moseley about researchers Bill Moore and Stanton Friedman, and how much he hated 1960s radio personality Long John Nebel. We also talked about the new director if MUFON and his company which offers “mile high club” (sex flights) for hire. There is much more in this conversation, which only lasted an hour and was interrupted twice by phone calls which Jim stopped the interview to answer.

Enjoy this talk with one of the true legends of the field and a good friend.

Image above is the title page of a book we talk about during the interview.

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48 comments on “Jim Moseley: Saucer Smear and Other Foibles

  1. Jim Moseley is a Bucket of Shit

    • Greg on said:

      Many people may not know what Joe is referencing here. When I interviewed Jim in the mid-1990s, he read an unreleased poem from Gray Barker which was titled “UFO Is A Bucket Of Shit.” I printed the poem verbatim in The Excluded Middle magazine and since then it has taken on a life of its own.

      Good show, Joe!

  2. misterloki on said:

    I have always enjoyed Mr. Moseley’s honesty and humor. Here’s hoping his surgery goes well, and he is around to stir up the hornet nest for years to come.

  3. Paul Kimball on said:

    Always nice to hear Jim chat on air with someone intelligent (as opposed to someone like Steinberg)!

    But where was the theme music at the beginning??

    • Greg on said:

      Did I leave the part of the interview in where Jim said that Steinberg claimed I had “49 listeners?” I don’t know where he would have gotten that figure or why he thinks that he has to compare his show to mine.

      You’re right, I should add the theme music.

      • Paul Kimball on said:

        Because it’s Gene Steinberg.

        Meanwhile, here’s hoping the Space People continue to watch out for Supreme Commander Moseley!

      • Sagacious on said:

        I asked Gene Steinberg about his statement. He thinks he was only joking and admits that he doesn’t know how many listeners you have. Personally, I listen to both shows, so its not an either/or for me.

        • Paul Kimball on said:

          Classic Gene “backstabbing with a smile” Steinberg.

        • Greg on said:

          I don’t care or mind much what he says about my show. As you point out, we’re different animals and his objectives are different from mine. He has concentrated his efforts on taking over a large segment of the paranormal broadcasting pie, while it matters little to me if I have 10 listeners or 10,000 (although closer to the high number might be nice.) :)

          • Paul Kimball on said:

            Leaving aside any further discussion of Steinberg, let me repeat: nice episode, amigo. The phone call interruptions were most amusing. The discussion of Moore was a nice bit as well.

          • Bob Desnos on said:

            Greg,

            I’d like to really unload on Gene Steinberg but won’t and will only say, your show is far and away better. Most especially because of the excellent conversations you tend to have with guests, and the friendly way in which you can be hostile (note Steinberg just comes off like an asshole). And perhaps most importantly, because you don’t try to sell me gun holsters, end of the world food or cheesy sci fi novels every 4 minutes.

  4. misterloki on said:

    I know that you are not trying to get into a pissing contest with anyone, but for what it is worth…

    I am an open-minded skeptic who came across Radio Misterioso entirely by accident about a year ago. I found it so interesting that I sought out other UFOlogical podcasts, all of which I listened to a few times and have since abandoned. You do a smart show that smart people find interesting, even when they don’t agree with the conclusions. This is in pretty stark contrast to the tone of most “paranormal” shows which seem to pander to the credulous.

    • Greg on said:

      This is exactly what I am trying to do. Thanks for noticing! (The attitude of the show, not starting a pissing match.)

      Actually, a lot of it is simply trying to satisfy my own curiosity and enjoy myself.

  5. Albert K. Bendover on said:

    Love listening to Jim Moseley. Great interview as always Greg. I wish you’d consider interviewing Guy Lyon Playfair about the Enfield Poltergeist and his views on skeptics. And his time in Brazil, etc. Interesting guy. The book he wrote on Enfield is fantastic.

  6. Red Pill Junkie on said:

    At the 25:00 of the interview Jim started referring to Aeolus Kephas’ essay Through a Fractured Glass, Darkly, posted at Reality Sandwich [Part One] and [Part Two]. Jason Horsley (Kephas) was a guest in Mike Clelland’s audio conversations some time ago, and his comments sparked quite a lively and interesting debate re. his opinion on Whitley Strieber.

    I think you should have Jason as one of your guests one of these days, Greg. I don’t agree 100% with what he says, but his ideas are very interesting and worth considering.

    Now, I don’t know if Strieber is a ‘mad genius’ or not. But I kind of suspect that our expectations from people who have allegedly experienced an intimate contact with a higher level of reality might be too unfairly lofty. I somewhat pair Strieber with Ray Stanford, who is a very intelligent man and has devoted his most of his career in trying to prove the physical reality of UFOs with very little recognition, yet he can be too stringent and cross if you dare to question his ideas or alleged evidence.

    Maybe being ‘blinded by the light’ doesn’t always yield the same positive effects on all people. After all, even after his conversion Saint Paul was still something of an asshole ;)

    • Greg on said:

      RPJ,
      I have thought of having Horsley on at some point. Maybe I will, if he will do it.

      Re: Strieber– As I have said with other personalities who seem to be in the twilight areas between believability and total crap, if their ideas are interesting, I almost don’t care about their truthfulness or reputations. I nether deify nor condemn him. If he was a dick (like some people I’ve discussed) it might be easier to pick him apart and reject his whole story. I can’t do that, because it has implications that still interest me.

  7. Red Pill Junkie on said:

    PS: Vallee didn’t speak at the main TED event in Long Beach. he spoke at the TED-X offshoot in Brussels

    Somebody should give Jim a fraking iPad already!! A tablet as a first computer wouldn’t be that intimidating :P

  8. Tony Morrill on said:

    Best line in the episode.

    Jim Moseley in regards to Long John Nebel “He was the most arrogant SOB I’ve ever dealt with.”

    Great show as always Greg!

    • Red Pill Junkie on said:

      Yeah! and despite that Jim had no problem being invited to his show!

      That says something about diplomacy ;)

  9. gheron on said:

    Another little gem. You can hear the mischievousness in his voice. The moment you start to take yourself seriously in this field then you are absolutely doomed. There may only be 49 of us, but what a 49 we are:). Keep up the good work – I listen to every show.

  10. Laurence Zankowski on said:

    Greg,

    I am listener #50! Ha!

    It is always Radio Mysterioso when I need clarity. Think it is time for a Walter, Greg, Nick, Don Ecker, Chris Knowles kitchen talk. But, with no twitter, call ins and other distractions.

    Be well

    Laurence

    • Greg on said:

      Just to be clear, that number of listeners is wrong. The last graphic on the bottom right has the current number of subscribers, which stands at 314 right now. That number varies from 280 to 350 depending on factors I do not know about. This does not count people who simply download the show and do not subscribe.

      So, I don’t really know exactly how many people listen to the show. It could be 300 or it could be thousands. I think it varies depending on who the current posted guest is and what keywords I choose to use for them.

      • Paul Kimball on said:

        Look at it this way, Greg. You might have fewer listeners (ed. note: who cares?), but at least those listeners get a better show, without commercials for survival gear and other crap. Oh, yeah – you’re not sharing time on a “network” with Alex Jones.

        Win, win, win. :-)

        File it under: “Some people will just never understand that quantity does not necessarily equal quality”.

        • Greg on said:

          Paul,

          As I said in my reply to “Sagacious,” I don’t ultimately care how many people listen to the show. Any program with that as its driving force is on the road to becoming a soulless piece of crap.

          And thank you for the kind words and support!

        • Bob Desnos on said:

          Now if we can only get Paul Kimball to stop tweeting how many calories he burned on the elliptical.

          • Paul Kimball on said:

            Actually, I think I did that two or three times, but haven’t in quite a while. You are, of course, always free to stop following me on Twitter. I hear Justin Bieber could use a few more fans, so maybe you could transfer your attention to hi. ;-)

          • Paul Kimball on said:

            P.S. Last night? Burned 1250 calories. Just thought you’d like to know.

      • Albert K. Bendover on said:

        I don’t subscribe. I just listen to the show.

  11. Lance Moody on said:

    Just had a nice long conversation with Jim tonight and then listened to this excellent interview. Nice job, Greg!

    Lance

  12. Bob Bobson on said:

    This was a great show — no doubt about it. Moseley’s view on something is worth probably a hundred others. I especially enjoyed his comments on Strieber and that Kephas article discussed.

    Regarding the latter: please don’t give that guy any air time. I don’t know how people keep coming up with the idea Kephas has something intelligent to say. His article is a combination of bad research, insinuation, and lousy reasoning and is of value only to those who already hold the view that Strieber is nuts.

  13. Albert K. Bendover on said:

    I thought the conversation surrounding the recent Vallee interview was interesting. Makes me wonder what exactly he was up to.

  14. drew hempel on said:

    Greg as listener #51 just thought you’d want the heads up on your Bennewitz book being “rewritten” in this thread http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread825493/pg1
    There’s a new Bennewitz book out that does a 180 on yours. Amazing how the “true believers” will do anything to twist reality around. But anyway thanks for the new Moseley interview.

    • Matt McKenzie on said:

      ATS is a cesspool.

      Maybe I shouldn’t dogpile on Steinberg, but I can’t resist. The Paracast is a mess even without the endless, sleazy advertising. And if this is a popularity contest, the craptasticness that is Coast To Coast AM would win every time.

      • Greg on said:

        Matt,

        I haven’t listened to it in months, so I would not know. I wanted to concentrate on my own show and interests, which I why I resigned from my co-hosting duties at Paracast. I have no advertising, because I (perhaps stupidly) don’t want to bother with it. One benefit of this is that I don’t have to care what advertisers or irate listeners think.

        • Red Pill Junkie on said:

          I *PRAISE* that you don’t have to cut a conversation in order to go to a commercial break.

          I understand that the Paracasters are trying to make a living out of their show and advertisers need to be satisfies, but as a listener allowing a conversation to flow to interesting places is far more important that hearing about how I need to buy a holster so I can carry a concealed gun because the IRS wants to audit my ass off and I need to remember to buy an extra case of camel’s milk and freeze-dried food because the economy is going to hell anyway :P

          Making fun of the Paracast’s advertisers is a cheap shot, I know, but as a member of their forum and being aware of the type of skeptic-minded and computer-savvy thirty-something individuals that engross their listening audience, it really makes you wonder if GCN Radio has ANY idea of their target market.

          PS: I have a habit of not subscribing to the sites I frequent. That said, I do have Radio Misterioso on my iTunes list as part of the podcast collection I like to listen to when I’m pedaling my bike ;)

  15. Paul Kimball on said:

    Hmm… anything with Ray “I have evidence but will never present it” Stanford is suspect right off the start.

    As for Bennewitz, Greg wrote the definitive account. Short of some shocking new revelations that would alter a reasonable person’s view of the case, Project Beta is the one and only source required.

    • Red Pill Junkie on said:

      Wasn’t Greg preparing a sequel to Project Beta?

      • Greg on said:

        I might. We’ll see. There are a few projects in the works. Which see the light of day remains to be seen.

        • Matt McKenzie on said:

          If you write it, I’ll buy it, Greg. Project Beta was a good read — although you’ll have to get better at cranking out self-aggrandizing BS if you want to get ahead in the UFO game. :-)

  16. Curt Collins on said:

    Just stumbled across this. A nice treat- pretty much just like a phone call with him. His comments about Bill Moore (and his far-reaching negative contributions) were pretty interesting. Greg stands up for Moore, but Jim remembers Moore’s hucksterism, showmanship and mercenary side. Greg’s comments about selling copies of the speech at $25 a pop are a great example of this.

    Getting back to Jim, I hope things go well for him. He really spans the eras and it’s a crime that his contributions are not more widely recognized. Thanks Greg for putting this show together.

    • Greg on said:

      Glad you enjoyed the show. I always like talking to Jim, and any excuse (like a show) is fine. Actually Tim Brigham was the one who suggested the conversation and I just provided a forum.

      I wouldn’t characterize Moore as mercenary or hucksterish. I would say that he tried in some ways to make a small living off of his efforts, which I can assure people he did not.

  17. Curt Collins on said:

    In case anyone hasn’t seen it yet, here’s the address for the “Mile High Club” charter flight that Jim discussed in Saucer Smear:
    http://www.flamingoair.net/mile-high-club-romantic-flights
    Book your own “Close Encounter” via the director or MUFON!

    • Greg on said:

      Curt,

      That’s just hilarious. Even more relevant (or something) since I’m working towards my pilot license right now.

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